SWGCraft Project

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Reverse Engineering 101



In SWG there are two kinds of Reverse Engineering (RE), they are ground RE and space RE. This section of the forum and this guide covers only ground RE.

Only Domestic, Engineer, and Munition Traders can do ground RE:
Domestic Trader --- for clothes
Munition Trader --- for armor
Trader Engineer --- for weapons
Only Structure Traders can do space RE.



Equipment

Reverse Engineering Tool --- this tool is used for all tasks in ground RE, it works for armor, clothes, and weapon enhancers. Its efficiency range is 0 to 10.00. All traders can craft this tool, also Structure Traders even though they cannot use it.

Socket Retrofitting Tool --- this tool can free up an occupied socket, an action that destroys the attachment; however, it does not exist any tool to get back attachments. The schematic for this retrofitting tool is obtained via an expertise option, but it is seldom used, if ever.



Skills and Abilities

There are three most important items to remember, select the Attachment Upgrade expertise, and improve on the RE Chance skill and the Luck attribute; crafting stations, city specializations, or any other kind of ability, buff, or skill does not have any proved effect. Other tasks related to RE benefit from other buffs, for example assembly for sockets.

RE Chance is more important than Luck; a master trader has 100 points and can obtain 10 more from the Deconstruction Technique expertise and thence it is a must-have expertise. Maximum is 159 points; see Appendix A for details.

Luck is obtained from modded suits, entertainer and smuggler buffs, eatables, stims, etc; see Appendix B for sources. It is debated when Luck vs. cost goes crazy but consensus is that Luck around 500 is enough for basic tasks, and 750 or higher works for HQ; the more the better on a deminishing scale of return.

Attachment Upgrade is a most important expertise, without it a trader cannot create multi-stat enhancements; this is a must-have expertise.

Sockets are added at random to an item in the crafting process but +160 Assembly "guarantees" a socket.
Notice: the type of Assembly must match the type of item: Artisan Assembly for Artisan items, Tailor Assembly for Tailor items, etc. Also, crafted jewelry never get sockets.



Concepts and Basic Overview

The basic items are: power bit, modifier bit, "skill enhancing attachment" (SEA), and "power-up" (PUP); and the basic terms include: "power bit order", "power conversion ratio", "basic modifier", and "exotic modifier".


Power bit --- this item is RE:d from a statted item. Max strengt is 35.

A statted item is an item with one or several stats and it is either looted, or it is crafted and a SEA with one or several stats is added to it. An item which is, or can be, bio-linked cannot be RE:d, not even by its owner.

RE a looted item and the resulting power is based on the best of its stats plus a bonus which is determined by the item's combat level (CL), by the trader's RE Chance and Luck, and by the dice roll.

RE a crafted item and the resulting power is at most +1 point per turn; a less skilled RE-trader struggles with the more 0-turns.

Order --- a power bit is 1st, 2nd, or 3rd order, which allows for the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd modifier at the final SEA:
1st order can be replaced by any other order, but...
2nd order requires a 2nd order, and...
3rd order requires a 3rd order bit.
For a PUP anything is OK.


Modifier bit --- this item is RE:d from two looted junk items of different kinds. The number of possible combinations is several thousands because more than 120 different junk items exist. Known combinations are reported by players like you and me to: The JunkYard.

Power Conversion Ratio is a property of all modifier bits and is an integer between 1 and 18, the fix value is set by the modifier type. The value of the power bit is divided by this ratio, see below.

Basic Modifiers: Agility, Constitution, Stamina, Block Value, Camouflage, Luck, Precision, and Strength; these have Power Conversion Ratio = 1.

Exotic Modifiers: all non-basic modifiers; they have Power Conversion Ratio up to 18.



Skill Enhancing Attachment (SEA) and Power-UP (PUP) are the final products from RE. To create these items one modifier bit and one power bit are put into the RE tool. To create a multi-stat SEA also another SEA is added to the tool, see below.

PUP --- this item has just one modifier but several charges and each charge lasts for 30 minutes. A PUP is temporarily attached to a breast-plate, shirt, or weapon and it does not need a socket.

The strength of a PUP is based on this formula: X varies around 1.0 but it is unclear exactly how X is defined. Either way, X is definitely there somehow and it is strongly governed by Luck and the dice roll.

A simpler and less accurate formula reads:
Notice:
-- A PUP cannot take any kind of Experimentation modifier.
-- For a short period it was possible to create +15 PUPs, however, now it seems as max is +11.


SEA --- this item can have max 3 modifiers; it is not possible to stack the same kind of modifier in one SEA.

The strength of a modifier at a SEA is determined by the following formula and it is set when the SEA is created
Notice: SEA with exotic modifiers
This type of SEA is possible to attach just to shirts, breastplates, and at any weapon. These are called Shirt, Breastplate, and Weapon SEA respectively. An important limitation is read in "Multi-Stat SEA".


Wanted Power: when dividing power by ratio any decimals are discarded, hence it is a waste to use a too strong power bit. This is a list of wanted power versus conversion ratio:

Examples:

Power bit: Assume you have a looted vest with Luck +17; its CL, your RE Chance and Luck, plus fortune affect the RE process so the resulting power bit comes out weaker, equally strong, or stronger, most often 1st order but sometimes 2nd order. Assume the vest resulted in a 1st order power bit with power 19.

Modifier bit: RE two looted junk items, for example Medical Console and Circuit which always results in a modifier bit with Reverse Engineering Chance. The conversion ratio is 10 for RE Chance.

SEA: Now use the power bit with strength 19 and the RE Chance modifier bit to create a SEA; this results in a SEA with RE Chance +1. The reason is that 19/10=1.9 which is rounded down to 1, decimals are discarded.

PUP: Assume your trader has RE Chance 110 and now rather use the power bit and the modifier to create a PUP.
2 * 35 / 10 * 110 / 100 * ~1.0 = 7.7 => 7.

Compare that with a trader who has 157 RE Chance, that yields a PUP with RE Chance +10 or perhaps +11 if you have high enough Luck and fortune that perhaps yields X > 1.00091. And a trader who has 159 RE Chance must rather be extremely unfortunate to face a 10.

Summation of Basics:

• Buff your RE Chance and Luck
• RE 1 statted item for a power bit
• RE 2 junk items for a modifier bit
• Use the power bit and the modifier bit to create a SEA or PUP

Remember, this is an example, usually a "boosted" power bit is used together with the modifier bit...



Boost a Power Bit

When you RE a looted item it normally gains some points of power, but it is still far from 30 or 35. With an iterative process (several repetitive steps) the power bit is slowly boosted upwards; how many iterations it takes is determined by your RE Chance, Luck, and fortune.

Prerequisites: The iterative process consumes a large amount of crafted items that must have sockets; suggested items are casual shoes, BH belt, and decorative knifes (I use "belt" in the examples). Furthermore, it consumes a large amount of basic modifier bits (non-exotic). Once you are prepared the iteration begins:

1. Maximize your RE Chance and Luck
2. Create the first SEA as described previously: 1 power bit + 1 modifier bit
3. Add the SEA to a belt
4. RE the belt to get back a power bit, hopefully a stronger one
5. Create another SEA with the power bit and a modifier
6. Repeat from 3) until the wanted power is obtained
7. Create the final SEA/PUP but with the wanted modifier

Remember that "wanted power" is determined by the conversion ratio of the wanted modifier, as is described above.

Misfortune in step 4 sometimes yields a weaker power bit, enforcing yet more iterations. However, if you face too many mishaps the risk is that RE Chance or Luck is insufficient.



Multi-Stat SEA

The Attachment Upgrade expertise is essential to be able to create multi-stat SEAs.

Limitation: If one or more exotic modifiers should go into the final SEA, one of them must be added in the first step, as the first modifier. This creates a shirt, breast-plate, or weapon attachment.

Prerequisites: This method consumes 3 power bits with the wanted powers (created as described above), 3 wanted modifier bits, one item with 2 stats, one item with 3+ stats, and a few casual modifiers and belts.

1. Create a first SEA; use the first power bit and the wanted modifier (remember the limitation about exotics)
2. Create a 2-statted SEA...
   
   1. If the second power bit already is 2nd order, go directly to step d --- otherwise, use it to create a temporary SEA with a casual modifier
   2. Add it to a belt
   3. RE the belt together with a 2-statted item to make a 2nd order power bit with retained power
   4. Create a SEA using this 2nd order power bit + a wanted modifier + the first SEA
3. Create a 3-statted SEA...
   
   1. Use the third power bit to create a temporary SEA with a casual modifier
   2. Add it to a belt
   3. RE the belt together with a +3-statted item to make a 3rd order power bit with retained power
   4. Create a SEA using this 3rd order power bit + a wanted modifier + the 2-statted SEA

Any strength works for the multi-statted loot because the power comes from the power bit.



Misc & FAQ

• Spec-Ops Duster takes Shirt Attachment but Armor PUP
• Jedi Robe takes Breastplate Attachment but Weapon PUP
• PSG takes Armor Attachment
• Wearable slots from head to toe: headwear, shoulder armor left+right, bicep armor left+right, gloves, shirt, breastplate, bandolier, belt, pants, and footwear (12 pieces)
• Jewelry: necklace, bracelets left+right, and rings left+right
• Inherent modifier: breastplates and weapons can be crafted with an inherent modifier, a socket, but no trader experimentation skills --- this inherent modifier is reduced to just 40% of the original power

Does the Socket Retrofitting Tool remove inherent modifiers crafted into items?
No, the tool removes only modifiers from the attached SEA, not modifiers crafted into the item.




APPENDIX A: RE Chance Sources




APPENDIX B: Luck Sources
Notice that the Cybernetic Deconstruction Arm will take away the Bicep and the Shoulder armor items, but net balance is still positive.
Meatlump King, see post by Phonelesscord.



APPENDIX C: RE Chance Modifier Bit Combinations:




Feralmonkey's RE Guide
Grreeta's RE Guide
The JunkYard

APPENDIX D: Known useful junk items ( from JunkYard ): (July 4, 2009)

APPENDIX E: Modifiers (from JunkYard) (July 5, 2009)

Misc Info:

Info on the Shard of Retaliation (SWG Wiki)

The Cybernetic Deconstruction Arm is a reward from the High Quality Resource Collection which adds +5 REChance and +110 Luck to you if the arm is applied:

To start the collection you simply use for example the Mineral Survey Device, find something to sample, and start to manually sample that resource. Sometimes the old and annoying Survey Event window will pop up but with a new, third option: "Search the area for high purity sample (2000 Action)" which you accept. Thence, do not run any macros disregarding this popup window. The Collection Journal updates itself after this point until you eventually have completed the collection.

You must get 5 such special events each one of the 6 survey devices: Chemical, Gas, Flora, Geothermal, Mineral, and Water. Details in CeigeMaraj's guide HOBBIES.

Admire this awesome image created by LongDongJohn: A Pictograph Guide to SEA RE-ing.



More info will come as you submit and/or I find it











As always, I warmly welcome any suggestions, ideas, and corrections.

/Zimoon

I've learnt a lot from this thanks!

However I was wondering.. I started RE-ing and I have made a few +35's now (Yay me) - However as I RE, the power bit changes between 1st Order and 2nd Order when all I am doing is RE-ing the item I put the SEA on.. is there a way to make sure I just get a 1st order or 2nd order instead of taking the chance? Also, does this happen with 3rd order too?

To my understanding and experience the flipping between 1st and 2nd order is totally random and it never flips to 3rd order. To be safe you must use a multi-stat item, looted or something you want to waste.

Reports say that if you throw in an item with Camouflage it will also flip to 3rd order, I have not done it yet myself so I haven't added that tip yet.

/Zimoon

Thanks a lot! I will look into this too

- Stobbart

One of the things we realized lately is that it's not always +90 luck as a level 90 Trader.

My MonCal 90 trader has 130 Luck (naked, unbuffed) and my Bothan 90 trader has 150 Luck (naked, unbuffed)

This could help people that are going to start a new Trader with the desire to be the very best at RE'ing, because people will try to get the absolute max luck possible so a 40-60 point difference will matter to them.

OK, I thought they had erased all racial bonuses, obviously not.
/Zimoon

They added them back in a few chapters ago, where were you :p.

My experience in making a LOT of +35s at a time with high luck and RE Chance you will end up with about 40% 1st orders when you are done. I then use the 1st orders to turn them into 3rd orders, so when I'm done I have almost entirely 2nd orders and 3rd orders. That way I don't have to worry about making sure I start with a 1st order (Since 2nd orders can be used as 1st orders, though 3rd orders cannot be used as 2nd or 1st orders)

If you need 2nd orders just take any random bit of looted stat item (can be as lot as a +1) and RE it with a +35 crafted item and it becomes a 2nd order bit.

Rather, where am I?

Often it feels as I am lost between the changes, which one is changed, which one is reverted,and which one never got changed in the first place

/Zimoon

From what I have seen/ tried, this is not the case.

- Stobbart

Thanks, that is exactly why I haven't added it, it is not yet verified. And if it will oly happen in some % of the cases, I will add a notice on that in due time
/Zimoon

It did work that way at one point with camo--not sure if that bug has been fixed yet or not but I'd be surprised if it hasn't been fixed.

Nice guide btw, Z One little thing you might clarify: under the Retrofit tool--it will only remove mods and add a socket for a crafted item. Looted items will not work with that tool.

Thanks a lot, added the clarification. Great to have more than one pair of eyes

/Z

I'm not sure if it applies to other weapons, but I know the Socket Retrofit Tool will remove the innate mods on Lightsabers like the Jinzu and Juyo's.

If you try to remove the SEA you kill those along with it