Heavy Additive enhancement

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quantanao
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Heavy Additive enhancement

Post by quantanao » Tue Jan 22, 2008 2:52 pm

I wonder how the additive bonus is calculated? I did some tests (same resources and the nutrition was maxed without spending all of the 13 available points):

Drink1 with 118's
nutritional value: 72.81

Drink1 with 119's
nutritional value: 74.22

Drink2 with 118's
nutritional value: 24.63

Drink2 with 119's
nutritional value: 24.83

So why is the difference on the first drink over 1 point and in the second only 0.2?

Questions:

- Do the additives enhance food and drinks different?
- Does the final outcome depend on complexity or resource quantity / quality?

HmmZ
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Sobuno
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Re: Heavy Additive enhancement

Post by Sobuno » Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:27 pm

24.63/118*119 = 24.83(873)

I don't know anything about Chef anymore, just happened to notice the above :P

The same calculation does not fit for drink1: 72.81/118*119 = 73.42(703)

Tharek Tolemac
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Re: Heavy Additive enhancement

Post by Tharek Tolemac » Tue Jan 22, 2008 4:44 pm

As far as I know, it is +119% of the original value.

So, if Drink 1 has 30 Nutrition normally and the Drink 2 has 40, the difference is absolutely bigger, but the same percentage, in this case: 1%

quantanao
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Re: Heavy Additive enhancement

Post by quantanao » Tue Jan 22, 2008 6:36 pm

Makes sense. I should drink more coffee before i post stuff :?

Thanks :mrgreen:
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Tharek Tolemac
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Re: Heavy Additive enhancement

Post by Tharek Tolemac » Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:56 am

Sorry, didnt see those questions before.
quantanao wrote: Questions:

- Do the additives enhance food and drinks different? As far as I can say, no. But depending on the type of tissue you use, Additives can have different effects.
- Does the final outcome depend on complexity or resource quantity / quality?
Complexity no. Resources influence the outcome by quality and quantity. So, if you have a resource with a quality of 100% for this stat combination and you need 10 units, and the other resource is quality of 50% and a amount of 20 units is needed, the resulting cap will be: (10*100%+20*50%)/30 = 66,66%

Zimoon
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Re: Heavy Additive enhancement

Post by Zimoon » Wed Jan 23, 2008 12:17 pm

The exact formulas for quality are read in detail in the Beginners Guide for Traders, stickied in the General Crafting forum. Tharek's example is correct!

Complexity is also described in detail that guide, but shortly, it affects only two sides in crafting:
1) Which tool plus crafting station you must use to see the schematic (table in the guide)
2) The final complexity affects the time for the item to finish, 2 s per point in the tool, 8 s per point in a factory. Each experimentation adds another point to the complexity, that's why I stress "final".

/Zimoon

Onyx
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Re: Heavy Additive enhancement

Post by Onyx » Sat Jan 26, 2008 5:37 pm

Actually, here's the correct formula for determining what you'll get with any given additive. There are four types of additives--one for each experimentation line--and each has three levels (light, medium, and heavy). Additives work the same for all foods and drinks and also work the same for whichever line they specifically enhance (duration, quantity, nutrition and filling although for filling it's a decreased amount rather than increase). The value of the additives bonus is the additional percentage you will be able to enhance that line's value by.

You take the unenhanced value of the item you are making. Let's say it's Flameout and with your resources you are able to experiment nutrition to 99% so the value you can get without additives for agility is 35.9.

Now let's say you're going to use a nutrition heavy additive with a bonus of +116. This means that it will increase the unenhanced value by an additional 116%.

The formula would look like this:
35.9 + (35.9 * 116%) = 77.544

If you were using a medium nutrition additive with a value of 88%, then the formula would be as follows:
35.9 + (35.9 * 88%) = 67.492

A quicker method is simply to add 1.0 to the additive's percentage value. In that case:

For +88 and 35.9 agility:
35.9 * 1.88 = 67.492

For +116 and our 35.9 agility:
35.9 * 2.16 = 77.544
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Sobuno
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Re: Heavy Additive enhancement

Post by Sobuno » Sat Jan 26, 2008 6:16 pm

Wouldn't the formula for calculating from x (118) to y (119) be: z/x*y? where z is the value of the x-enhanced stat (72,81 for example)

The formula works fine for drink2, but fails in drink1

base value of drink1 with 118's: 72,81/218*100 = 33,40
enhanced with 119: 33,40*2,19 = 73,146

base value of drink1 with 119's: 74,22/219*100 = 33,89
enhanced with 118: 33,89*2,18 = 73,88

Was there a typo in the example named drink1?

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Re: Heavy Additive enhancement

Post by Onyx » Sat Jan 26, 2008 6:31 pm

Yea, I'd guess there was as well (or different resources were used). If you do the division by the 2.18, then you should indeed get the actual base value.

I get the same results as you do and the base value for the two was different. There is one small bit that isn't factored in here, but it wouldn't cause the difference to be that much. Additives do have a hidden decimal. I haven't paid attention to that for quite a while but the difference is negligible--i.e. tenths of a point.
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Re: Heavy Additive enhancement

Post by Sobuno » Sat Jan 26, 2008 6:43 pm

Onyx wrote:Yea, I'd guess there was as well (or different resources were used). If you do the division by the 2.18, then you should indeed get the actual base value.

I get the same results as you do and the base value for the two was different. There is one small bit that isn't factored in here, but it wouldn't cause the difference to be that much. Additives do have a hidden decimal. I haven't paid attention to that for quite a while but the difference is negligible--i.e. tenths of a point.
Good, just had to make sure I wasn't going crazy

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